Typical Age of Carrier Strike Group Commander

[WriteWright]

Well, the title pretty much says it: I need to know the typical age of a carrier strike group commander, these days. Has that changed much since, say, WWII?

For any help, thanks!

[Scott Chisholm]

Hi,

CSG Commanders are 1-Star Admirals, or very junior 2-Stars. Figure on them having about 26-28 years in at the time. Assuming age 22 at time of commissioning, and you get a guy around 50 years of age.

Hope that helps.

[Ed Rotondaro]

Hi,

CSG Commanders are 1-Star Admirals, or very junior 2-Stars. Figure on them having about 26-28 years in at the time. Assuming age 22 at time of commissioning, and you get a guy around 50 years of age.

Hope that helps.

Scott:

I picked up some paperback brief guides on modern US naval topics. Once covers destroyers the over covers carrier battle groups. They features lots of full color pictures and a glossary of terms and slang. What they have in common is that the COs always look late 40s and serious as hell. Maybe becoming a captain isn't all its cracked up to be? How are you enjoying your almost civilian status my friend?

[WriteWright]

Hi,

CSG Commanders are 1-Star Admirals, or very junior 2-Stars. Figure on them having about 26-28 years in at the time. Assuming age 22 at time of commissioning, and you get a guy around 50 years of age.

Hope that helps.


Thanks, Scott. I had guessed -- and it was just a guess -- that the typical age was more like the late mid-50s. Glad I checked.

[Scott Chisholm]

Thanks, Scott. I had guessed -- and it was just a guess -- that the typical age was more like the late mid-50s. Glad I checked.

Early to mid-50s would be about right.

[Scott Chisholm]

Scott:

I picked up some paperback brief guides on modern US naval topics. Once covers destroyers the over covers carrier battle groups. They features lots of full color pictures and a glossary of terms and slang. What they have in common is that the COs always look late 40s and serious as hell. Maybe becoming a captain isn't all its cracked up to be? How are you enjoying your almost civilian status my friend?

Ed,

CVN COs are the golden children of the USN. First, they are all aviators. I've never met a rotory wing CVN CO, but I guess it's possible.

Second, they've had an aviation squadron command tour...

Third, they get fast-tracked through nuke school. I had the PXOs of VINSON and EISENHOWER in my nuke school class. You'd be amazed at the questions they'd ask. "Hey, Scott! Explain this steam thing to me again..."

Fourth, after nuke school they go be XOs on a CVN, after which they go to a "deep draft" command - traditionally an AOE, but I guess it could be an LPD or some other non-CRUDES ship that has an Air Department.

After all of that, they go to Crystal City (home of Navy Nuclear Propulsion) to attend several months of "Charm School" where they learn the politics of being in command of a nuclear-powered ship.

So, a year of nuke training, 18 months as an XO, 18 months as a CO, 6 months of Charm School...what's that? About 4-1/2 years? These guys are selected for that pipeline as 19-year post-command Commanders, and they are pretty much assured of making Flag if they don't screw up.

Yeah, they're serious. As a heart attack.

In 24 years in the Navy, I've only every heard of one CVN CO who didn't make Flag. The only CVN XO I know who didn't make it to CVN command was a leg shaver at Tailhook....:eek:

[Ed Rotondaro]

Ed,

CVN COs are the golden children of the USN. First, they are all aviators. I've never met a rotory wing CVN CO, but I guess it's possible.

Second, they've had an aviation squadron command tour...

Third, they get fast-tracked through nuke school. I had the PXOs of VINSON and EISENHOWER in my nuke school class. You'd be amazed at the questions they'd ask. "Hey, Scott! Explain this steam thing to me again..."

Fourth, after nuke school they go be XOs on a CVN, after which they go to a "deep draft" command - traditionally an AOE, but I guess it could be an LPD or some other non-CRUDES ship that has an Air Department.

After all of that, they go to Crystal City (home of Navy Nuclear Propulsion) to attend several months of "Charm School" where they learn the politics of being in command of a nuclear-powered ship.

So, a year of nuke training, 18 months as an XO, 18 months as a CO, 6 months of Charm School...what's that? About 4-1/2 years? These guys are selected for that pipeline as 19-year post-command Commanders, and they are pretty much assured of making Flag if they don't screw up.

Yeah, they're serious. As a heart attack.

In 24 years in the Navy, I've only every heard of one CVN CO who didn't make Flag. The only CVN XO I know who didn't make it to CVN command was a leg shaver at Tailhook....:eek:

Scott:

I'm not 100% satisfied that a CVN CO needs to be an aviator. Hell with all the staff on board, he has plenty of people to draw advice from. First off ya gotta be a ship handler when driving a CVN. I'd trust a sub skipper over an airedale anyday.

Ahh Tailhook, the crash and burn of many a budding career.

Speaking of heart attacks, I had a EKG today and other tests due to some chest pains that scared me. I'm scheduled for a nuclear stress test in a week. Be careful about getting old, everything starts to hurt.:o

[Scott Chisholm]

Scott:

I'm not 100% satisfied that a CVN CO needs to be an aviator. Hell with all the staff on board, he has plenty of people to draw advice from. First off ya gotta be a ship handler when driving a CVN. I'd trust a sub skipper over an airedale anyday.

Ahh Tailhook, the crash and burn of many a budding career.

Speaking of heart attacks, I had a EKG today and other tests due to some chest pains that scared me. I'm scheduled for a nuclear stress test in a week. Be careful about getting old, everything starts to hurt.:o

Ed,

Good luck with the ticker - my prayers are with you!

The Black Shoe Navy screwed the pooch with the carrier commands back in the '30s, and the Brown Shoes have since convinced Congress that only an Aviator can properly coordinate air operations. Never mind the fact that Black Shoes command our LHA/Ds, which is a much harder task.....

[djcyclone]

Scott:

Be careful about getting old, everything starts to hurt.:o



What if your only 25 and your body feels like your already 50???
Hell I am already old, and I should be young.:eek:

Guess I took the Phrase "GRAB LIFE BY THE HORNS" to seriously.:D

[djcyclone]

Scott:

I'm not 100% satisfied that a CVN CO needs to be an aviator. Hell with all the staff on board, he has plenty of people to draw advice from. First off ya gotta be a ship handler when driving a CVN. I'd trust a sub skipper over an airedale anyday.

:o



I don't know. How manny subs have we had run aground in the last 20 years???
I heard of an incident (I believe it was the Kennedy a long time ago) where a Carrier collided with a smaller pleasure boat. There was no damage to the Carrier, but the pleasure boat was crushed. The civilian boat was in the wrong and got in the way.:confused:
I believe the Carrier was doing a 360 degree turn while not moving forward (one propeller going forward the other in full reverse).

Even though it was the civilians fault, the CO still had to give up his command and his career. The Navy is pretty anal about running aground, or colliding with ships. People who have successful careers in the Navy and go on to be 4 star adimrals have one thing and one thing only (Lots and Lots of Luck.) Knowing what the hell your doing never hurts either, but mainly just luck.

[Scott Chisholm]

I don't know. How manny subs have we had run aground in the last 20 years???
I heard of an incident (I believe it was the Kennedy a long time ago) where a Carrier collided with a smaller pleasure boat. There was no damage to the Carrier, but the pleasure boat was crushed. The civilian boat was in the wrong and got in the way.:confused:
I believe the Carrier was doing a 360 degree turn while not moving forward (one propeller going forward the other in full reverse).

Even though it was the civilians fault, the CO still had to give up his command and his career. The Navy is pretty anal about running aground, or colliding with ships. People who have successful careers in the Navy and go on to be 4 star adimrals have one thing and one thing only (Lots and Lots of Luck.) Knowing what the hell your doing never hurts either, but mainly just luck.

Luck is the serendipitous coincidence of opportunity and initiative.

Having been in the position where I evaluated Commanding Officers, I have found that those who are successful make their own luck.

COs can survive groundings, collisions and allisions (hitting something that's not moving, such as the pier or a ship moored to a pier) depending on the circumstances. In '94 I watched a USN FFG bounce off the side of a Brazilian oiler twice during an UNREP approach. The CO, an acquaintance of mine, fully expected to get booted, but was saved by the fact that the Brazilian CO was the fair haired golden boy of their navy and was destined to be their CNO. The Brazilians talked the USN out of firing my buddy so they would not have to reciprocate by firing their CO.

Bilateral good will....

A more mundane example was a grounding investigation I conducted in 2005. The CO was "buoy hopping" and turned based on his position relative to a channel bouy. Unfortunately, the buoy was out of position and he ended up turning too soon. A combination of wind and seas then set him into a mud bank. There was minimal damage to the ship, and my findings determined that he would have been fine had the buoy been in the right place. The CO got slapped around, but retained his command.

[djcyclone]

My expierience with this would somewhat agree with what you have said. When we where in Gibralter, the CO got the brilliant idea to pull out of harbor without the use of tugs. It was not the most inteligent thing to do, and as soon as we untied the current pushed us into a spruence class destroyer next to us. The damage was minimal, but I thought the Co would be done for.

Do not get me wrong. I liked the captain and was not hoping for anything of the sort, but I just thought the Navy would can him after that. I do not know how he got away with it, but he remained in command until shortly after I left the ship, over a year later.

[Scott Chisholm]

My expierience with this would somewhat agree with what you have said. When we where in Gibralter, the CO got the brilliant idea to pull out of harbor without the use of tugs. It was not the most inteligent thing to do, and as soon as we untied the current pushed us into a spruence class destroyer next to us. The damage was minimal, but I thought the Co would be done for.

Do not get me wrong. I liked the captain and was not hoping for anything of the sort, but I just thought the Navy would can him after that. I do not know how he got away with it, but he remained in command until shortly after I left the ship, over a year later.

Having conducted many investigations throughout my career, and making disciplinary recommendations in support of them, I can safely state that there are numerous ways to punish a CO and not relieve him. Write him a bad fitness report, and he'll never have command again. Withhold an end-of-tour medal, and eyebrows will be raised at his next promotion board. A telephone call to the right people will permanently derail his career.

Then, of course, you can always Courts-Martial him....